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Thread: How I explain why .mobi instead of m.domain.com

  1. #1
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    Lightbulb How I explain why .mobi instead of m.domain.com

    First let me say that I don't want to start a pointless .mobi vs everything else thread, but just wanted to help by sharing of my reasoning which I hope could be of some help for explaining dot mobi to friends/family etc who are only familiar with m dot.

    I usually provide the following example when explaining .mobi to those who am familiar with m dot. Of course in this example m dot could be exchanged by mobile.domain.com or domain.com/mobile or any other naming convention other than .mobi .
    This example is based around how the swedish (ccTLD) country extension .se (dot se) is used as the preference for swedish sites in... well in Sweden
    There is another convention also used in Sweden which ends in .com/sv but this is not used as much as .se and therefore I like to compare these to the use of m dot and .mobi when putting forward .mobi

    Mainly my reasoning could be described as such:

    domain.se
    domain.com/sv


    compare this with:

    domain.mobi
    m.domain.com


    So if you look at the first example with domain.se and domain.com/sv you could say that domain.se would be useless and dividing the internet into different camps; with one internet with english content and the other with swedish content. Also that websites would be forced to have many kinds of websites and not feature all the content on just the .com .
    Based on those arguments .se (dot se) wouldn't possible work (along with any other CCTLDs like .co.uk , .eu etc based upon the same arguments) but still .se is the standard naming convention in Sweden for websites with Swedish content.

    In the same way if we look at the second example with .mobi and m.domain.com all the same arguments could be provided and actually is provided by all those opposed to .mobi ; that the internet could be divided into different camps with .mobi in one corner and .com in one corner, and also that websites would be forced to have many kinds of websites and not feature all the content on just the .com . Those are the same arguments that could be used against the ccTLDs, but even so the ccTLDs have been a success and nobody is now arguing (what i've heard at least) that they are dividing the internet.
    It's by looking upon this simple comparison which I'm (among other things) basing my opinion that .mobi will be the standard naming convention for websites with mobile content.

    This is what I mainly use to describe to those who've seen m dot in use why .mobi still would be the first choice in the future for everybody providing mobile content on their websites.

    Also as a little sidenote for those arguing that .mobi is too long, ponder the following:
    domain.mobi (11 characters with the dots)
    m.domain.com (12 characters with the dots)

    I'm also interested in what arguments you're using when encountering people who've never heard of dot mobi or who favours the m dot convention?

    Best regards,
    Jonas

  2. #2
    Senior Member noonoo1's Avatar
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    A nice little phrase is

    Com for computers
    Mobi for mobile

  3. #3
    MobiEnthusiast coast's Avatar
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    Anything that uses a dot to the left of the domain name is a subdomain and does not pass pagerank. Additionally, many carriers are using transcoding and stripping header information on .com and other tld sites unless that site is on a whitelist. Names with .mobi are automatically whitelisted.

    If a company is concerned that they want to keep their pagerank and search engine results intact by adding files to their domain names, like something.com/mobile, that will preserve pagerank but is an inconvenience for anyone who wants to type an address into a phone. That's why a number of companies will keep their ugly URL but also register a .mobi name and redirect it to the page instead of having end users type in all that junk.

    I have an example of this on my blog for Target.mobi at http://mobienthusiast.mobi/target-mobi-hits-the-mark/

    It should further be noted that for new sites, it's been my experience that google spiders .mobi names before I am done creating them, while my new .com sites sit unvisited by search engine spiders for weeks.

    Hope this helps.
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  4. #4
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    Thumbs up Thanks!

    Quote Originally Posted by coast View Post
    Anything that uses a dot to the left of the domain name is a subdomain and does not pass pagerank. Additionally, many carriers are using transcoding and stripping header information on .com and other tld sites unless that site is on a whitelist. Names with .mobi are automatically whitelisted.

    If a company is concerned that they want to keep their pagerank and search engine results intact by adding files to their domain names, like something.com/mobile, that will preserve pagerank but is an inconvenience for anyone who wants to type an address into a phone. That's why a number of companies will keep their ugly URL but also register a .mobi name and redirect it to the page instead of having end users type in all that junk.

    I have an example of this on my blog for Target.mobi at http://mobienthusiast.mobi/target-mobi-hits-the-mark/

    It should further be noted that for new sites, it's been my experience that google spiders .mobi names before I am done creating them, while my new .com sites sit unvisited by search engine spiders for weeks.

    Hope this helps.
    Thanks Coast, your post will be of great help for me to further explain the advantages of .mobi to those who've never heard of it.

    May I ask some questions just to make sure I understand your post completely?

    A subdomain could acquire it's own pagerank but it won't have the same pagerank as the main domain. It could also never add on the any other pages pagerank by linking to them. Have I understood correctly?

    What does it mean that many carriers uses transcoding and stripping header information on sites that are not on a whitelist, could you provide a small example of this?

    Thanks again, repped+

    Best regards,
    Jonas

  5. #5
    MobiEnthusiast coast's Avatar
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    Hi Jonas,

    Here are some links regarding transcoding:
    http://wurfl.sourceforge.net/vodafonerant/
    http://wurfl.sourceforge.net/vodafon...wsj/nigel.html
    http://wapreview.com/blog/?p=918

    Here is an example of what transcoding will do to a site, written for non-techies on my blog: http://mobienthusiast.mobi/make-your...iendly-take-2/

    If you would like to see any site transcoded, you can go to http://mURL.mobi and type in the desktop site's URL to see how it would look transcoded.

    As for the pagerank question, here's an actual example:

    facebook.com has a pagerank of 9/10
    m.facebook.com has a pagerank of 6/10

    Twitter fares better since it is billed as a mobile site
    twitter.com pagerank 9/10
    m.twitter.com pagerank 9/10

    Here's a site that redirects its mobi to an m.

    ESPN.mobi redirects to http://m.espn.go.com/wireless/index?w=17zym&i=MOBI
    Pagerank 6/10
    ESPN.com 8/10

    Still, the ESPN redirect saves end users from having to type in that monster of a URL, so again, using .mobi is a marketing and customer service bonus.

    Using a non-mobile example, here's this one from a twitter post:

    films.ie 4/10
    forums.films.ie 3/10

    Did I make that clear enough, or would you like to discuss this further?

    All the Best,
    Holly
    Last edited by coast; 01-11-2009 at 03:56 PM.
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  6. #6
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    Hello Holly,

    Thanks for an again indepth reply with some great examples. I think I understand now what's meant with transcoding. Please correct me if I'm wrong and messed it up somehow, but I've understood as such: There are some carriers that doesn't care whether a m dot site has device detection or not, but just strips down the .com version of the site and serves that content to the user, even though it would have provided a better user experience if the device detection had been followed by the carrier. This could never happen to a .mobi domain where all carriers always follows the device detection on the site.
    Hope I got everything right!

    Regarding subdomains; I've understood as per your posts that subdomains are counted in Google as different sites and therefore doesn't have the same pagerank as the main site. But is it possible for subdomains with pagerank to add to another domains pagerank or even to the main sites pagerank?
    For example: If I would have www.domain.com and then would create 5 other subdomains from domain.com , let's say;
    1.domain.com
    2.domain.com
    ...etc
    If those subdomains would have attained pagerank in and of itself by having relevant content that other sites linked to, and I then linked those subdomains to the main site (www.domain.com). Would www.domain.com then get higher pagerank because of the links from it's 5 subdomains?

    Maybe I'm bordering here on the territory of the mysterious Google pagerank algorithm which've never been confirmed as how exactly it works!

    Thanks again,
    Jonas

  7. #7
    MobiEnthusiast coast's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheJD View Post
    I've understood as such: There are some carriers that doesn't care whether a m dot site has device detection or not, but just strips down the .com version of the site and serves that content to the user, even though it would have provided a better user experience if the device detection had been followed by the carrier. This could never happen to a .mobi domain where all carriers always follows the device detection on the site.
    Correct (mostly): some carriers do not pay any attention to header information (including device detection) unless that site is on their whitelist. Typically .mobi is automatically whitelisted because it is a tld that is designed for mobile use. This is a procedural decision by the carriers and not a technological feature. mTLD talks about the mysterious "zone file" which denotes .mobi sites as mobile, but perhaps Andrea or James from mTLD would need to elaborate on that.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheJD View Post
    Regarding subdomains; I've understood as per your posts that subdomains are counted in Google as different sites and therefore doesn't have the same pagerank as the main site. But is it possible for subdomains with pagerank to add to another domains pagerank or even to the main sites pagerank?
    For example: If I would have www.domain.com and then would create 5 other subdomains from domain.com , let's say;
    1.domain.com
    2.domain.com
    ...etc
    If those subdomains would have attained pagerank in and of itself by having relevant content that other sites linked to, and I then linked those subdomains to the main site (www.domain.com). Would www.domain.com then get higher pagerank because of the links from it's 5 subdomains?

    Maybe I'm bordering here on the territory of the mysterious Google pagerank algorithm which've never been confirmed as how exactly it works!
    I don't have access to the pagerank algorhythm (I'd be out on my yacht and not posting if I were, haha). However, I am pretty sure that a subdomain's links to it's root domain don't carry much weight. If the subdomain links to an outside domain, that would probably be weighted more heavily. The difficulty with the subdomains is that they need their own inbound links from trusted sites. The only benefit I can think of outside of convenience for site visitors for these subdomain to root domain and back links is that the spiders might visit the subdomain from the link, but even that is not guaranteed.
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  8. #8
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    Thumbs up

    Thanks once again Holly, your posts have been very helpful and I've learnt some new things from them.

    Quote Originally Posted by coast View Post
    mTLD talks about the mysterious "zone file" which denotes .mobi sites as mobile, but perhaps Andrea or James from mTLD would need to elaborate on that.
    Yes it would be really nice to hear what mTLD could reveal about this.


    Best regards,
    Jonas

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    Quote Originally Posted by coast View Post
    mTLD talks about the mysterious "zone file" which denotes .mobi sites as mobile, but perhaps Andrea or James from mTLD would need to elaborate on that.
    Hi, there's nothing mysterious about our zone file. The zone file is a text file with a list of all the domains registered from a given TLD, each TLD provides it, normally for a fee. All search engines buy this zone file and get it on a scheduled time and use it for crawling. The reason why a newly created second level domain (andrea.mobi) will most likely be crawled before a third level domain (test.andrea.mobi), because it appears as new in that text file, as opposed to a third level domain that will appear only when the crawler searches for updates for a certain domain in the DNS.

    The mTLD zone file does not provide any special information related to domain that other zone files do not provide, it is understood by everyone, though, that .mobi domains will be mobile friendly and that in fact is also a requirement that mTLD had from the ICANN. For this reason, I think most transcoders and search engines will think content on a .mobi should be mobile.

    This does not prevent anyone from creating ALSO desktop-friendly content and most search engines will analyse the content anyway, not just ASSUME it is mobile.

  10. #10
    Founding Member Scandiman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrea Trasatti View Post
    Hi, there's nothing mysterious about our zone file. The zone file is a text file with a list of all the domains registered from a given TLD, each TLD provides it, normally for a fee. All search engines buy this zone file and get it on a scheduled time and use it for crawling. The reason why a newly created second level domain (andrea.mobi) will most likely be crawled before a third level domain (test.andrea.mobi), because it appears as new in that text file, as opposed to a third level domain that will appear only when the crawler searches for updates for a certain domain in the DNS.

    The mTLD zone file does not provide any special information related to domain that other zone files do not provide, it is understood by everyone, though, that .mobi domains will be mobile friendly and that in fact is also a requirement that mTLD had from the ICANN. For this reason, I think most transcoders and search engines will think content on a .mobi should be mobile.

    This does not prevent anyone from creating ALSO desktop-friendly content and most search engines will analyse the content anyway, not just ASSUME it is mobile.
    Thanks for the zone file explanation. Are you at liberty to say how often it is used by the search engines ... daily, weekly, etc?

  11. #11
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    Thumbs up Thank you!

    Quote Originally Posted by Andrea Trasatti View Post
    Hi, there's nothing mysterious about our zone file. The zone file is a text file with a list of all the domains registered from a given TLD, each TLD provides it, normally for a fee. All search engines buy this zone file and get it on a scheduled time and use it for crawling. The reason why a newly created second level domain (andrea.mobi) will most likely be crawled before a third level domain (test.andrea.mobi), because it appears as new in that text file, as opposed to a third level domain that will appear only when the crawler searches for updates for a certain domain in the DNS.

    The mTLD zone file does not provide any special information related to domain that other zone files do not provide, it is understood by everyone, though, that .mobi domains will be mobile friendly and that in fact is also a requirement that mTLD had from the ICANN. For this reason, I think most transcoders and search engines will think content on a .mobi should be mobile.

    This does not prevent anyone from creating ALSO desktop-friendly content and most search engines will analyse the content anyway, not just ASSUME it is mobile.
    Thanks Andrea for a great reply with lots of information, it's nice to have you here interacting and answering questions directly.

    Best regards,
    Jonas

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    Quote Originally Posted by noonoo1 View Post
    A nice little phrase is

    Com for computers
    Mobi for mobile
    .COM stands for "commercial", not "computers" ...

    -Jeff

  13. #13
    Mobility Regular acc's Avatar
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    That is a nice little phrase :

    .com is for COMputers
    .mobi is for MOBIles.

    I like it.

  14. #14
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    but now many companys use m.domain instead of .mobi,i think

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    for many sites "m." in the domain name means that it's a site intended for or designed for mobile devices, but ya just never know...

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